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At Gadsden, Ala, May 20-23 on miracles, Holy Spirit baptism, signs and wonders.
Bro. Woods did a masterful work in defending the faith. He conducted himself as a gentleman. Bro. Franklin slipped once and called us "Campbellites." He later apologized.
Henry McCaghren moderated for Woods; and a bro. Hill moderated for Franklin. Both Franklin and Hill were gospel preachers but now espoused neo-Pentcostal doctrine. During the debate, Franklin tangled himself into a number of contradictions. On his charts he taught that the tongues in the N.T. were ecstatic. Woods produced proof from Franklin's book that he did not believe they were ecstatic. Franklin denied that was what he meant, but later said it made no difference. Franklin was pressed to reveal what he thought I Cor. 12:13 was saying. He had to be forced by bro. Woods to admit what kind of baptism was under consideration. Finally, he admitted it was H.S. baptism. Franklin had written in his book that he had been baptized in water for the remission of sins and 25 years later baptized into the Holy Spirit. Woods asked him if he had the remission of sins 2 years before he was baptized into Christ by the Holy Spirit. He refused to reply.
When Franklin was pressed on I Cor. 13:8-10 and Eph. 4:11-13, he stated these offices and gifts would cease in the Perfect Age. Bro. Woods produced a chart which would not allow Franklin to say the Perfect Age was in Heaven, for it would have involved him in saying error and immaturity would be found in heaven. Therefore, he said the Perfect Age would be here on earth. This is Premillennialism! This left Franklin in a dilemma from which he never escaped.
Franklin was confused. He gave Eph. 19 chapters. He had Paul writing II Pet. 3:16,17. He often apologized for his mistakes and complained that he was not a debater and did not like debates. Woods pointed out that Franklin had said that the Holy Spirit had led him into the debate and asked him if he dislike what the Holy Spirit led him into doing! Franklin refused to reply. Franklin complained about Woods's charts and said he could not answer them on the same night he saw them for the first time because he was not capable of doing so. Yet, on his charts he showed where one with H.S. baptism would have the Spirit guiding him into all truth. What Franklin lacked, the H.S. could make up. One Holy Spirit would have defeated a million Guy N. Woods! But it was evident that Franklin did not have what he argued for.
Franklin was often guilty of misquoting and misreading scriptures. He referred to Mark 6:5 three or four times to show why he as not going to perform miracles. But Jesus did heal a few sick folks. Franklin could heal no one. In fact, he argued that our unbelief negated his belief and kept him from healing anyone. Yet, I Cor. 14: 22 says tongues are for those who do not believe!
Franklin used Phil. 4:9 and said we ought to be like Paul, even in believing in and performing miracles. When Woods pointed out II Cor. 12:12 and asked Franklin if he did what Paul did, he never brought up the argument again. Hill, moderator for Franklin, said if he were debating he would confirm his word with miracles. The only miracles that happened were ones Franklin told about happening in Calif. and other places. No one miracle, sign or wonder was performed in Gadsden.
The last night Franklin had not yet discussed most of Wood's charts. When pressed he asked Fred House, overhead projector operator, to put up frames No. 1 to 14. Just before arriving at the most damaging charts, Franklin told House to stop the machine. House said there are three more. Franklin told him that was enough. Woods spoke up from his seat, "I thought you wanted to see all of them." Franklin replied: "I've changed my mind."
The debate will go down in history as the turning point of Pentecostalism in the church of Christ. Anyone who truly wants the truth will be able to see the fallacy of Franklin's position. We owe a dep sense of gratitude to Guy N. Woods for his defense of the truth.
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Guy N. Woods vs Ben Franklin (gospel preacher espousing Pentecostal ideas)
June 20, 1974
Gadsden, Alabama
(By Ray Hawk)
June 20, 1974
Gadsden, Alabama
(By Ray Hawk)
At Gadsden, Ala, May 20-23 on miracles, Holy Spirit baptism, signs and wonders.
Bro. Woods did a masterful work in defending the faith. He conducted himself as a gentleman. Bro. Franklin slipped once and called us "Campbellites." He later apologized.
Henry McCaghren moderated for Woods; and a bro. Hill moderated for Franklin. Both Franklin and Hill were gospel preachers but now espoused neo-Pentcostal doctrine. During the debate, Franklin tangled himself into a number of contradictions. On his charts he taught that the tongues in the N.T. were ecstatic. Woods produced proof from Franklin's book that he did not believe they were ecstatic. Franklin denied that was what he meant, but later said it made no difference. Franklin was pressed to reveal what he thought I Cor. 12:13 was saying. He had to be forced by bro. Woods to admit what kind of baptism was under consideration. Finally, he admitted it was H.S. baptism. Franklin had written in his book that he had been baptized in water for the remission of sins and 25 years later baptized into the Holy Spirit. Woods asked him if he had the remission of sins 2 years before he was baptized into Christ by the Holy Spirit. He refused to reply.
When Franklin was pressed on I Cor. 13:8-10 and Eph. 4:11-13, he stated these offices and gifts would cease in the Perfect Age. Bro. Woods produced a chart which would not allow Franklin to say the Perfect Age was in Heaven, for it would have involved him in saying error and immaturity would be found in heaven. Therefore, he said the Perfect Age would be here on earth. This is Premillennialism! This left Franklin in a dilemma from which he never escaped.
Franklin was confused. He gave Eph. 19 chapters. He had Paul writing II Pet. 3:16,17. He often apologized for his mistakes and complained that he was not a debater and did not like debates. Woods pointed out that Franklin had said that the Holy Spirit had led him into the debate and asked him if he dislike what the Holy Spirit led him into doing! Franklin refused to reply. Franklin complained about Woods's charts and said he could not answer them on the same night he saw them for the first time because he was not capable of doing so. Yet, on his charts he showed where one with H.S. baptism would have the Spirit guiding him into all truth. What Franklin lacked, the H.S. could make up. One Holy Spirit would have defeated a million Guy N. Woods! But it was evident that Franklin did not have what he argued for.
Franklin was often guilty of misquoting and misreading scriptures. He referred to Mark 6:5 three or four times to show why he as not going to perform miracles. But Jesus did heal a few sick folks. Franklin could heal no one. In fact, he argued that our unbelief negated his belief and kept him from healing anyone. Yet, I Cor. 14: 22 says tongues are for those who do not believe!
Franklin used Phil. 4:9 and said we ought to be like Paul, even in believing in and performing miracles. When Woods pointed out II Cor. 12:12 and asked Franklin if he did what Paul did, he never brought up the argument again. Hill, moderator for Franklin, said if he were debating he would confirm his word with miracles. The only miracles that happened were ones Franklin told about happening in Calif. and other places. No one miracle, sign or wonder was performed in Gadsden.
The last night Franklin had not yet discussed most of Wood's charts. When pressed he asked Fred House, overhead projector operator, to put up frames No. 1 to 14. Just before arriving at the most damaging charts, Franklin told House to stop the machine. House said there are three more. Franklin told him that was enough. Woods spoke up from his seat, "I thought you wanted to see all of them." Franklin replied: "I've changed my mind."
The debate will go down in history as the turning point of Pentecostalism in the church of Christ. Anyone who truly wants the truth will be able to see the fallacy of Franklin's position. We owe a dep sense of gratitude to Guy N. Woods for his defense of the truth.
VIEW NEXT REPORT >>
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